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	<title>Comments on: the potential of web typography</title>
	<atom:link href="http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/</link>
	<description>hacks.mozilla.org</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Yoga Das</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-401391</link>
		<dc:creator>Yoga Das</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Mar 2011 13:15:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-401391</guid>
		<description>I use @font-face {
             font-family:&quot;Concielian Break&quot;;
			 src: url(&quot;../font/concav2.ttf&quot;)
			 }

but this font does not show mozila firefox.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I use @font-face {<br />
             font-family:&#8221;Concielian Break&#8221;;<br />
			 src: url(&#8220;../font/concav2.ttf&#8221;)<br />
			 }</p>
<p>but this font does not show mozila firefox.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: John Drinkwater</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-153252</link>
		<dc:creator>John Drinkwater</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Sep 2010 14:24:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-153252</guid>
		<description>NoScript prevents loading @font-face by default because it could be used to run malicious code on your system (via buffer overflows, etc)
http://hackademix.net/2010/03/24/why-noscript-blocks-web-fonts/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NoScript prevents loading @font-face by default because it could be used to run malicious code on your system (via buffer overflows, etc)<br />
<a href="http://hackademix.net/2010/03/24/why-noscript-blocks-web-fonts/" rel="nofollow">http://hackademix.net/2010/03/24/why-noscript-blocks-web-fonts/</a></p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bhupesh</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-144440</link>
		<dc:creator>Bhupesh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Sep 2010 05:30:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-144440</guid>
		<description>well, it turns out noscipt does not like @font-face property.
Otherwise works even if js is turned off in browser itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>well, it turns out noscipt does not like @font-face property.<br />
Otherwise works even if js is turned off in browser itself.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bhupesh</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-144414</link>
		<dc:creator>Bhupesh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Sep 2010 05:18:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-144414</guid>
		<description>Hi,
I am trying this on firefox 3.5 with NoScript extension and it does not work if NoScript is enabled.

Why is that? What does it have to do with javascript if this is purely a CSS thing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,<br />
I am trying this on firefox 3.5 with NoScript extension and it does not work if NoScript is enabled.</p>
<p>Why is that? What does it have to do with javascript if this is purely a CSS thing?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Wtk</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-87278</link>
		<dc:creator>Wtk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 12:14:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-87278</guid>
		<description>Other the CSS how does the font get on the page? Is it temporarily installed on the end users computer?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Other the CSS how does the font get on the page? Is it temporarily installed on the end users computer?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Sam</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-84440</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Apr 2010 01:06:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-84440</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand all this hype about it. IE got it since back 1994... ? So what&#039;s the point? The point is THAT YOU MIGHT DISTRIBUTE COPYRIGHT PROTECTED FONTS IN A NON LEGAL MANNER and you might even do that in putting you client in bad light.

So this works for free fonts (which basically are 90% crap or useless) and not for copyright protected fonts.

So be carefull and don&#039;t burn your fingers guys.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand all this hype about it. IE got it since back 1994&#8230; ? So what&#8217;s the point? The point is THAT YOU MIGHT DISTRIBUTE COPYRIGHT PROTECTED FONTS IN A NON LEGAL MANNER and you might even do that in putting you client in bad light.</p>
<p>So this works for free fonts (which basically are 90% crap or useless) and not for copyright protected fonts.</p>
<p>So be carefull and don&#8217;t burn your fingers guys.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: stk</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-14641</link>
		<dc:creator>stk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Sep 2009 07:54:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-14641</guid>
		<description>@Matthew ... this page works fine in my winFireFox3.5.2 ... dunno what the problem might be</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Matthew &#8230; this page works fine in my winFireFox3.5.2 &#8230; dunno what the problem might be</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Vivian</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-14611</link>
		<dc:creator>Vivian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 15:17:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-14611</guid>
		<description>As exciting as this is, I can&#039;t help but have some fears about @font-face leading to a lot of ugly typography on the internet. 

Hopefully it will make the internet a more beautiful place, and not like a bunch of designers got drunk on the punch and barfed fonts everywhere.

My full blog post: http://blog.twg.ca/2009/09/4-fears-of-font-face/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As exciting as this is, I can&#8217;t help but have some fears about @font-face leading to a lot of ugly typography on the internet. </p>
<p>Hopefully it will make the internet a more beautiful place, and not like a bunch of designers got drunk on the punch and barfed fonts everywhere.</p>
<p>My full blog post: <a href="http://blog.twg.ca/2009/09/4-fears-of-font-face/" rel="nofollow">http://blog.twg.ca/2009/09/4-fears-of-font-face/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-14264</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 07:41:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-14264</guid>
		<description>Thank you for sharing this demo. I noticed your demo page works just fine on a Mac with FF 3.5.2, but does not work at all in Windows with FF 3.5.2. Both browsers allow pages to choose their own fonts. Any thoughts?

Kind regards,
Matthew</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for sharing this demo. I noticed your demo page works just fine on a Mac with FF 3.5.2, but does not work at all in Windows with FF 3.5.2. Both browsers allow pages to choose their own fonts. Any thoughts?</p>
<p>Kind regards,<br />
Matthew</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: stk</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-2095</link>
		<dc:creator>stk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jul 2009 15:49:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-2095</guid>
		<description>I found this article exciting.  I went on to experiment (and succeed) with cross-browser font embedding and &lt;a href=&quot;http://randsco.com/index.php/2009/07/04/cross_browser_font_embedding&quot; title=&quot; x-Browser Font Embedding &quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;created a tutorial&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt; for anyone interested in embedding fancy fonts in their web pages.

Bottom line:  With FFx&#039;s support of @font-face, it&#039;s now possible for cross-browser font embedding with FFx, Safari, IE6, IE7 and IE8 (and purportedly Opera v10 &amp; Google Chrome following soon).

&lt;strong&gt;My observation:&lt;/strong&gt; Of all the user agents that render embedded fonts, FireFox is the &lt;em&gt;only one&lt;/em&gt; that shows a perceptible delay, when loading a page containing embedded fonts (i.e., page initially renders with - assume &quot;the default&quot; fonts - then re-renders and &quot;flashes&quot;, loading the embedded fonts).

This text-replacement re-rendering is most annoying and I&#039;m wondering if there is way for FireFox to remedy this, as other user agents seem to have accomplished?

(Behavior noted in FireFox for both on my &quot;x-Browser Fonts&quot; article and the &quot;Potential of Web Typography&quot; article).

Cheers,
-stk</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I found this article exciting.  I went on to experiment (and succeed) with cross-browser font embedding and <a href="http://randsco.com/index.php/2009/07/04/cross_browser_font_embedding" title=" x-Browser Font Embedding " rel="nofollow"><strong>created a tutorial</strong></a> for anyone interested in embedding fancy fonts in their web pages.</p>
<p>Bottom line:  With FFx&#8217;s support of @font-face, it&#8217;s now possible for cross-browser font embedding with FFx, Safari, IE6, IE7 and IE8 (and purportedly Opera v10 &amp; Google Chrome following soon).</p>
<p><strong>My observation:</strong> Of all the user agents that render embedded fonts, FireFox is the <em>only one</em> that shows a perceptible delay, when loading a page containing embedded fonts (i.e., page initially renders with &#8211; assume &#8220;the default&#8221; fonts &#8211; then re-renders and &#8220;flashes&#8221;, loading the embedded fonts).</p>
<p>This text-replacement re-rendering is most annoying and I&#8217;m wondering if there is way for FireFox to remedy this, as other user agents seem to have accomplished?</p>
<p>(Behavior noted in FireFox for both on my &#8220;x-Browser Fonts&#8221; article and the &#8220;Potential of Web Typography&#8221; article).</p>
<p>Cheers,<br />
-stk</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ugh</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-2008</link>
		<dc:creator>ugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Jul 2009 00:32:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-2008</guid>
		<description>Ugh, putting us all at the whim of tasteless &quot;designers&quot; the world over. I will continue to browse with &quot;Allow pages to choose their own fonts&quot; OFF, thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ugh, putting us all at the whim of tasteless &#8220;designers&#8221; the world over. I will continue to browse with &#8220;Allow pages to choose their own fonts&#8221; OFF, thanks.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Koolwriting.com</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1906</link>
		<dc:creator>Koolwriting.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jul 2009 19:37:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1906</guid>
		<description>It won&#039;t catch on as well (virally) if we can&#039;t use it inline.  Does it work inline too, like with a &quot;span&quot; tag?  

For example, let&#039;s say someone wants &quot;kool&quot; symbols of cats, dogs, whatever.  People will use this if I can say, &quot;Here, cut and paste this one line of code.&quot;  

But if trying new fonts requires connecting &quot;style&quot; references in disparate sections of code, this confuses people, and you won&#039;t see as much adoption, creative implementation by non-specialists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It won&#8217;t catch on as well (virally) if we can&#8217;t use it inline.  Does it work inline too, like with a &#8220;span&#8221; tag?  </p>
<p>For example, let&#8217;s say someone wants &#8220;kool&#8221; symbols of cats, dogs, whatever.  People will use this if I can say, &#8220;Here, cut and paste this one line of code.&#8221;  </p>
<p>But if trying new fonts requires connecting &#8220;style&#8221; references in disparate sections of code, this confuses people, and you won&#8217;t see as much adoption, creative implementation by non-specialists.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcelo Cantos</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1619</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcelo Cantos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 21:57:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1619</guid>
		<description>Correction: the other major sticking point is that end-users can still pilfer legitimately-licensed fonts from a web site and use them in offline materials that aren&#039;t subject to browser-reporting. This leaves us back in the tarpit of conventional DRM.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction: the other major sticking point is that end-users can still pilfer legitimately-licensed fonts from a web site and use them in offline materials that aren&#8217;t subject to browser-reporting. This leaves us back in the tarpit of conventional DRM.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcelo Cantos</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1618</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcelo Cantos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 21:43:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1618</guid>
		<description>[I don&#039;t work in this area, so please accept my apologies for taking up everyone&#039;s time if my wonderful &quot;new&quot; idea turns out to be as old as the hills.]

WRT licensing, the problem here is different to the one DRM usually tries to solve. Normally, DRM locks out the end-user from experiencing content they have sought and acquired, but haven&#039;t gained the rights to experience. In this case, however, it is a class of content providers (web sites) that need to be controlled, with end-users invariably becoming unwitting cohorts. Perhaps a different solution is possible in this circumstance...

Designers could digitally sign and license font files on a per-web-site basis. Most web browsers would refuse to load incorrectly licensed font-files, and report the &quot;fingerprint&quot; of unlicensed font-files to a monitoring agency (mostly just a database that maps each licensed fingerprint to an owner/email). Of course, reporting would be at the users discretion, so designers working on and testing fonts could opt out, and maybe even store the fingerprint as &quot;trusted&quot;. Web sites, however, would lack the ability to control reporting, and would thus expose themselves to copyright infringement charges. The fingerprint could also serve to prevent a designer from defrauding another designer by acquiring digital signing rights for someone else&#039;s font.

The only real sticking point is developing a robust fingerprinting method that survives font-tweaking by infringers. Some method that allows partial fingerprint matching and forces the infringer to materially alter the appearance of the font would be ideal. Normal digital &quot;fingerprints&quot; such as SHA-1 wouldn&#039;t do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[I don't work in this area, so please accept my apologies for taking up everyone's time if my wonderful "new" idea turns out to be as old as the hills.]</p>
<p>WRT licensing, the problem here is different to the one DRM usually tries to solve. Normally, DRM locks out the end-user from experiencing content they have sought and acquired, but haven&#8217;t gained the rights to experience. In this case, however, it is a class of content providers (web sites) that need to be controlled, with end-users invariably becoming unwitting cohorts. Perhaps a different solution is possible in this circumstance&#8230;</p>
<p>Designers could digitally sign and license font files on a per-web-site basis. Most web browsers would refuse to load incorrectly licensed font-files, and report the &#8220;fingerprint&#8221; of unlicensed font-files to a monitoring agency (mostly just a database that maps each licensed fingerprint to an owner/email). Of course, reporting would be at the users discretion, so designers working on and testing fonts could opt out, and maybe even store the fingerprint as &#8220;trusted&#8221;. Web sites, however, would lack the ability to control reporting, and would thus expose themselves to copyright infringement charges. The fingerprint could also serve to prevent a designer from defrauding another designer by acquiring digital signing rights for someone else&#8217;s font.</p>
<p>The only real sticking point is developing a robust fingerprinting method that survives font-tweaking by infringers. Some method that allows partial fingerprint matching and forces the infringer to materially alter the appearance of the font would be ideal. Normal digital &#8220;fingerprints&#8221; such as SHA-1 wouldn&#8217;t do.</p>
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		<title>By: John Drinkwater</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1389</link>
		<dc:creator>John Drinkwater</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 20:56:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1389</guid>
		<description>If you want to create custom glyphs for presentation, put them into the unicode private use block range so they dont clash with anything else on the planet…</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you want to create custom glyphs for presentation, put them into the unicode private use block range so they dont clash with anything else on the planet…</p>
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		<title>By: Chaac</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1326</link>
		<dc:creator>Chaac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 02:26:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1326</guid>
		<description>@Craig Mod:
I have seen the baseline grid on both and I see the very small difference you mention. That&#039;s it? It think the difference is too subtle to state only one browser renders &quot;as intended&quot;. I think both browsers do show &quot;The potential of web typography&quot; quite nicely.

Greetings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Craig Mod:<br />
I have seen the baseline grid on both and I see the very small difference you mention. That&#8217;s it? It think the difference is too subtle to state only one browser renders &#8220;as intended&#8221;. I think both browsers do show &#8220;The potential of web typography&#8221; quite nicely.</p>
<p>Greetings.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Craig Mod</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1322</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig Mod</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 02:15:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1322</guid>
		<description>@Chaac:

Thanks for posting this screenshot. It&#039;s subtle, but there is at least one difference: Safari&#039;s interpretation of the margins / line-height of the drop-cap-glyphs. If you press &#039;b&#039; on the page to turn on the baseline grid, the difference between the Firefox and Safari versions becomes much clearer. 

Best,
C</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Chaac:</p>
<p>Thanks for posting this screenshot. It&#8217;s subtle, but there is at least one difference: Safari&#8217;s interpretation of the margins / line-height of the drop-cap-glyphs. If you press &#8216;b&#8217; on the page to turn on the baseline grid, the difference between the Firefox and Safari versions becomes much clearer. </p>
<p>Best,<br />
C</p>
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		<title>By: Chaac</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1292</link>
		<dc:creator>Chaac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 18:50:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1292</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t seem to find ANY difference between the way Firefox and Safari render fonts in the demo. I uploaded a file to my server so you can see it for yourself: http://www.hclientes.com/font-face.png

(Safari 4 on the left, Firefox 3.5 on the right)

If you see any difference, please post.

Greetings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t seem to find ANY difference between the way Firefox and Safari render fonts in the demo. I uploaded a file to my server so you can see it for yourself: <a href="http://www.hclientes.com/font-face.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.hclientes.com/font-face.png</a></p>
<p>(Safari 4 on the left, Firefox 3.5 on the right)</p>
<p>If you see any difference, please post.</p>
<p>Greetings.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1222</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 06:40:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1222</guid>
		<description>Lauren: pressing D, B and G on the website will toggle a few fancy features. Thus, when pressing Cmd-D, you&#039;re toggling the text shadow.

Which leads me to an important rule they ignored: when performing keyboard handling, always check for modifier keys. Drop shadow shouldn&#039;t toggle when the user wants to favorite your website, your numbers-only field shouldn&#039;t block the user from pressing Ctrl-A, and so on.

Also: if you plan to use custom fonts, &lt;em&gt;please&lt;/em&gt; use font-size-adjust. Watching the text jumping around when the new fonts load is very, very annoying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lauren: pressing D, B and G on the website will toggle a few fancy features. Thus, when pressing Cmd-D, you&#8217;re toggling the text shadow.</p>
<p>Which leads me to an important rule they ignored: when performing keyboard handling, always check for modifier keys. Drop shadow shouldn&#8217;t toggle when the user wants to favorite your website, your numbers-only field shouldn&#8217;t block the user from pressing Ctrl-A, and so on.</p>
<p>Also: if you plan to use custom fonts, <em>please</em> use font-size-adjust. Watching the text jumping around when the new fonts load is very, very annoying.</p>
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		<title>By: Mozilla releases Firefox 3.5 - Programming Blog</title>
		<link>http://hacks.mozilla.org/2009/06/web-typography/comment-page-1/#comment-1184</link>
		<dc:creator>Mozilla releases Firefox 3.5 - Programming Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jun 2009 23:58:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hacks.mozilla.org/?p=1000#comment-1184</guid>
		<description>[...] Docs; the ability to show video built into Web pages without plug-ins; a private browsing mode; fancy downloadable fonts; and geolocation technology that can let Web sites know where you [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Docs; the ability to show video built into Web pages without plug-ins; a private browsing mode; fancy downloadable fonts; and geolocation technology that can let Web sites know where you [...]</p>
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